Gwen Shamblin quotes: Denies the Trinity, Teaches Salvation by Works, Remnant Fellowship

May 18, 2004: Police Raid WDW
Detectives testified that the couple admitted to using glue sticks to beat their son. It's an idea that a NewsChannel Five Investigation discovered, originated inside Remnant Fellowship, a church that preaches strict discipline of children.

Detectives said they hope the search will yield evidence that may explain what the Smiths were thinking and what role, if any, their religious beliefs played in the death of the child.

"Weigh Down Workshop Quotes from Gwen's Trinity message and Archived Email Messages"

Former WDW Coordinator's & Follower's testimonies

Weigh Down Workshop News, Links, Articles, and Controversial Teachings Reviewed."

Weigh Down Workshop Questions and Answers "Why should I drop the WDW program.. when it has helped so many people?"; "Wouldn't it be cruel to cancel the program?"
More WDW Questions and Answers: Signs? Programs? Now what?

Resources

WDW: The Hard Facts:
For those of you who need some hard facts on the Weigh-Down workshop theology and goals..I have collated the following archived WDW email messages along with the WDW Trinity message and Mission Statement into categories. Unfortunately, these messages are no longer available on the web since Listbot shut down. But, these quotes are copied from the actual archived WDW emails which were sent to participants. You can then draw your own conclusions about this controversy by reading these quotes and the actual statement on the Trinity still on the WDW site.
1. The Nature of God and the Trinity: Some quotes from Gwen Shamblin's statement on the Trinity with refutations:
"ACCORDING TO THE TRINITY, JESUS AND GOD ARE THE SAME BEING. WHAT DO YOU BELIEVE? IS JESUS GOD? The answer: I believe that Jesus and God are two separate beings. I believe that Jesus is our Lord (referenced hundreds of times) and our God (referenced approximately three times), but I believe that the God of Jesus is God the Father. Jesus is not God the Father. There are over 100 references to God as the Father, over 40 references to Jesus as the Son of God, a child's name, "Immanuel" (referenced in Isaiah and Matthew), means "God with us" and He is referred to as "Prince of Peace, Mighty God" in Isaiah 9:6. All citations in the Bible to God’s Holy Spirit reference the word "Spirit." Therefore I believe that a child reading the Bible would easily understand what God is trying to get across to us - that God is the Father, Jesus is the Son of God, and God’s Holy Spirit is the spirit of God. God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit are one in purpose, and yet, where Jesus’ will does not line up with the Father’s, through sweatdrops of blood, Jesus submitted and said, "Not my will, but yours be done" (Luke 22:42), indicating there are two separate beings."
"Teachers of the Trinity teach that Jesus is Jehovah; they have no scriptures to back this up, and why don’t they believe that Jesus is the Son of God and that Jehovah is Jehovah?" G.S.

....How does Gwen explain this verse which explicitly identifies the Messiah as the "mighty God, everlasting Father"?
Isa 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. NIV

"DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS EQUAL IN POWER AND GLORY? The answer: No. "The head of Christ is God" (1 Cor 11:3). And yet Jesus has been granted the right hand of God and has been given all authority over heaven and earth, powers, rulers, and authorities, so that He would have supremacy over everything except for God Himself (see 1 Cor 15:27-28). Even though God "was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in Him" and gave Him authority to forgive sin, and all authority was given to Him, and He was made our Lord and Savior by the Father, no scripture says that Jesus is the Father - but every scripture says that He is the Son of God and the Messiah (Christ)." G.S.

....Jesus Himself claims to be God. Finally, if Jesus is God, we might expect Him to say so. Have you ever wondered why He didn't simply state, "I am God?" and put an end to any possibility of confusion? Actually, He did. What He says in John 8:58 was to His Jewish audience a far more explicit statement than if He had merely said "I am God." ...58 Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." 59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple.
Notice that these men understood precisely what Jesus was saying. And because He obviously also understood what they were asking, His reply is all that much more significant. He was telling them He was God, using the name Jehovah Himself had revealed to Moses at the burning bush, "I AM." He could have made no stronger claim of deity.
The gospel of John includes a whole series of statements Jesus made about Himself using this name "I AM"—I am the way, the truth, and the life (Jn. 14:6); I am the good shepherd; I am the door; I am the bread of life; I am the light of the world. Each one of these statements, studied in context, reveals that He was making claim after claim of absolute deity. Resource: Who is Jehovah, Who is Jesus? by Phillip R. Johnson
2. Authority:
Email #15 Turning it Around: “God has given me the words to say..”
#16 “An Army for War”: "I know that this is an expression of support for the Truth of God....I want to thank everyone who is applying this Truth of God’s life and becoming disciples of the true Jesus Christ message."
#22 The Message: As I look back on all of the stories and the lessons that God has given me to teach...”
#23 Do Not Become Weary: “It is essential that you learn the will of God by staying in His Word and listening to the tapes or watching the videos.”
#27 The Boss 11: "As you read this, please know that a spirit is being poured out by God right now to get you off the fence. In other words, you will feel a tug on your heart. You will either have a desire and be drawn to get completely under God’s authority and every authority instituted on earth by God, or you will feel a strong resistance to these teachings and want to get out from underneath authority and be your own boss."
#29 "Solid Food": "I was a leader from God , so they submitted themselves freely to the teachings on the tapes and followed EVERYTHING." "Has it taken some time to learn to distinguish between good and evil? The answer is YES........The people who watched Weigh Down’s Orientation Video and decided from the start that I was a leader from God, so they submitted themselves freely to the teachings on the tapes and followed EVERYTHING. They did not arrogantly pick and choose some of the teachings, but ALL of them,..."
#30 Deceiving Spirits: "All I can do is present this Truth message that God has shown me..."
#31: Sounding the Trumpet: "I’m so excited about getting to share with you the truth about God and what He is up to.” “I do believe I have been called as a watchman, and my job is to sound the trumpet and to warn God’s rebellious people to turn around today –- Destruction is coming upon those who continue in sin, those who are abusing this precious grace of God."
#32 The Key to this Treasure: “I feel like I have the same call that Ezekiel, Jeremiah, Amos, Zephaniah, and Micah all had -- and that is to warn people to TURN because God is so angry right now.”
#33 Through the Word of Truth: “After conceiving this truth, stay in God’s Word, and stay in your workbook, the tapes, the videos, and the class, all the while continuing to ignore the lies and letting this truth grow. Repeat it every day, all the time. Believe it, and after five weeks you will have been born again of Holy Seed. He chose to give you birth through the word of truth, as we read above. You cannot mix these truths of God that I am trying to show you with lies, for it will led to death.
3. Salvation by Faith or Works?:
#22 The Message: “So you see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone...”
#23 Do Not Become Weary: "So, eagerly work on making your calling and election sure, for if you do these things, you will be welcomed into God’s eternal Business or Kingdom."
#7 Only Look to God..."Please put your reputation at the cross and remember that all that matters is God’s approval."
#33 Through the Word of Truth: “After conceiving this truth, stay in God’s Word, and stay in your workbook, the tapes, the videos, and the class, all the while continuing to ignore the lies and letting this truth grow. Repeat it every day, all the time. Believe it, and after five weeks you will have been born again of Holy Seed. He chose to give you birth through the word of truth, as we read above. You cannot mix these truths of God that I am trying to show you with lies, for it will led to death. “
#34 Because You Do Know the Truth: (repeats #33's message)“...five weeks you will have been born again of Holy Seed.... Feed only the Truth, and I promise you that you will be re-birthed in a whole new way of approaching your food.”
#40 Obedience is Life: " Obedience is life to me and disobedience is death to me."
WDW Mission Statement: “Jesus taught us that it is not those who just hear His words who are saved, but it is those who do the will of God who will be saved” WDW Teaching on the Trinity in the Mission Statement: “GOD THE FATHER, JESUS CHRIST THE SON, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT As a ministry, we believe in God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. However,the Bible does not use the word "trinity," and our feeling is that the word "trinity" implies equality in leadership, or shared Lordship. It is clear that the scriptures teach that Jesus is the Son of God and that God sends the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit does not send God anywhere. God is clearly the Head. Note this passage from 1 Corinthians 15:27-28: "For he ‘has put everything under his feet.’ Now when it says that ‘everything’ has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." Philippians 2:6 says that Jesus "did not consider equality with God something to be grasped." Therefore, we feel that we grieve Jesus when we do not watch our words and their meaning—especially a word not found in either the Old or New Testament, writings that span centuries of God’s inspired word. If God had wanted us to refer to Himself, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit as the "trinity," He would not have left this word completely out of the Bible.”
4. WDW’s present Seminar and call to reform the church:
Gwen's conference Desert Oasis "Rebuilding the Wall":
#31: Sounding the Trumpet: "I’m so excited about getting to share with you the truth about God and what He is up to. I believe these are jewels not to be thrown before swine or nay-sayers or people that are never going to let God rule their lives. This message is for the saints – those people who know that they are rightful subjects to His majesty, the Great I AM. I do believe God is trying to get through to His people to warn them. I do believe I have been called as a watchman, and my job is to sound the trumpet and to warn God’s rebellious people to turn around today – not tomorrow, or the next day, but TODAY. Destruction is coming upon those who continue in sin, those who are abusing this precious grace of God."
#36 A Wonderful Sign: "Desert Oasis will be about: (1) examining our own Temple (self) for purity and devotion ... and (2) examining the church as a whole. Poor God…we take such care of our own homes, while His remains a ruin (Haggai 1:9). Sin is in the church in increasing measure, so do not be afraid to examine this sanctuary. Paul says this is our job (1 Cor 5:9-13), and God wants us not to let each fellowship become a stronghold where you are so comfortable or so proud of it that you do not want to re-examine it according to the scriptures. Ezekiel 24:20-21 says ...”’” In other words, you can actually be open-minded about examining yourself (the Temple of God) but close-minded about examining the leadership and corporate body! This is a shame." Please let us know quickly, because we are trying to identify people (before Desert Oasis) who are prepared to help establish true repentance and total Lordship in their local communities. There is much work to be done..... God told Jeremiah, “See today I appoint you over nations (of sin or lukewarmness) and kingdoms (fellowships that have set themselves up against the authority of God) to uproot and tear down, to destroy and overthrow, to build and to plant” (Jer. 1:10). We have started a Fellowship Division for those who know that America’s churches are in desperate need of reform. God is calling us to wake up and arise and shine!
#37 Pilot Class Update: “How and why this message has been left out of most basic church teaching is a mystery, but in many ways, we now have the opportunity to go back and plant the Good News inside both non-Christians AND the lukewarm pew-warmers that we all have in our own churches. In other words, this is true evangelism and true missionary work, and all of you are planting true “holy seeds” (Isaiah 6:11-13) of purity for God’s Kingdom.”
#40 Obedience is Life: "There are many lies that have crept into the church that we are going to uncover at Desert Oasis, and one of them is the comfort level we now have with disobedience toward God."
#41 Tree in the Garden: "I believe the part of the historical cycle that we are living out is where God is gathering up a remnant of people who are obedient. Nehemiah1:8-9 "We are to rebuild His broken walls and ruined temple. But we are going to have to wake up and realize that we have been in Babylon. We have actually been sitting in religious institutions that have allowed increasing rebellion to God. So before you can even start rebuilding the temple, most of us are going to have to understand God’s word well enough to know that we have to pack our bags and get out from underneath leadership that has allowed a grace message that gives people a license to sin (Jude verse 4).

In conclusion, it is obvious that the WDW organization has moved away from the biblical, orthodox Christian doctrines which teach that God is three Persons in One: Father, Son and Holy Spirit, that Jesus Christ is fully God, that the Holy Spirit is a person and fully God, and that salvation is by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone.

Read about the Weigh Down Workshop Questions and Answers "Why should I drop the WDW program.. when it has helped so many people?"
See the Christian Research Institute and Midwest Christian Outreach for more information on cults. Please contact Don Veinot at 630-527-9028 for a copy of the MCO Journal with the Weighed Down With False Doctrine article or Lynette Hoy. Read A Response to Gwen by MCO and Christian Research Institute article on WDW as well as the Apologetics Index article on WDW.

See the CHRISTIAN APOLOGETICS & RESEARCH MINISTRY article: Weigh Down Weight Loss founder Gwen Shamblin denies the Trinity. They state that Gwen Shamblin's "view is very close to the Jehovah Witness teaching about God".

See Dr. Ray Pritchard's sermon on the Trinity: God in Three Persons: A Doctrine We Barely Understand for a biblical view. Read Who is Jehovah, Who is Jesus? by Phillip R. Johnson.
See Shamblin's Doctrine of God and the Gospel of Jesus Christ by Steven A. McKinion.
And for Calvary Memorial Church's statement on the Trinity, the Nature of God and Salvation by Grace see their: Articles of Faith.

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See the Weigh Down Workshop News, Links, Articles, and Controversial Teachings Reviewed page.
Lynette Hoy, NCC, LCPC

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Notice: This column is not intended to take the place of direct professional mental health services but rather to provide insight into various problem situations and possible helpful resources and interventions. Please contact AACC for a referral to a mental health professional. .